My conversation over EN"LIGHT"ENING Rail

Okay I don’t how else to post this except to post the entire thread so it makes sense and flows believe me when I tell you it is worth the read to see how people think and what the mind set is out there that we need to overcome.

Suzanne: I am totally behind this concept and
hopefully someday to be a reality!!

Laurie Lee Masterson: I am not necessary opposed to a
light rail system, just where is the money going to come
from? Who is going to pay the 1-2 million upfront for the
feasibility study? When asked if this system has been implemented anywhere
comp. to NWA, the answer was no. My next question would
be - Can you please give me the area this system is
implemented and is profitable?
We are staring at huge Federal tax increases, potential
millage increase for Fay High, unemployment is up, the
economy on a whole is unstable.
Is this a responsible time to spend 2 million dollars on
something that is not a necessity?

Suzzane: I have to add that this IS a necessity for
those of us who have to commute. I am talking big picture.
While it may not benefit everybody, projects such as the high
school are using my tax dollars for which I receive NO benefit
at all, given that I chose not to have any children. Net, net...I
am not even in support of expanding the high school and
think I have the right to have my tax dollars put toward
something that will actually benefit people like me, and there
are many of us who make that commute every day just to
survive.And...at a price, including dodging death
after being hit by a semi truck driver and dodging road ragers
on a daily basis. I am fully in support of this initiative, as
many other citizens are, as evidenced by the comments. Not
only is it our right (those of us who would use it) but the
benefits are many.


Laurie Lee Masterson: Suzanne without trying to be totally
confrontational I am not sure what you mean it is your
"right". Would you please refer me to where that is in either
the state or federal Constitution?
Your argument may be little foiled n the fact that I don't use
either one..my children go to private school and we have 3
cars and commute everyday. The actual argument is not is the Light rail something we
would all use and enjoy, I would use and enjoy a yacht but I
don't have the money, and Fayetteville doesn't have the
money for this project at this time.
Tax money is not about "getting" something YOU/I want our
to make life easier.

S.K.: We all need to consider carefully the notion that
we pay tax dollars for things we don't use or don't benefit
directly from...great schools in FYV make it a desirable place
to live, and your personal prosperity benefits in many ways
(think of the value of your home). Likewise, light rail will
remove hundreds to thousands of cars from I-540 daily - ...
Ms. Masterson: You own 3 cars and commute
everyday. Calculate your personal cost of owning 3 cars
(purchase prices, sales tax, insurance, maintenance) and the
annual cost of your daily commuting (fuel). Do you think your
taxes to pay for a light rail project would exceed your current
annual expenses related to reliance on personal
transportation? I wager your savings would be substantial.

Laurie Lee Masterson :SK I don’t know of anyone who does
not want to live in a "desirable" place, that is not the
question. The question is where is the money? We cannot
continue to spend or commit to spend money we don't have
for things we don’t have to have to impress people we don't
even know. A 'desirable" community would be one that is responsible and
disciplined with it's money and models that for it's citizens.
There is real "benefit" in financial security.
And on that note if it is "not about the money" (as far as what
it cost in taxes to build) then why do they keep telling us how
much money we will save in gas, and insurance, and hwy
construction...etc. I live in the county, if the light
rail is built I (and most everyone else) still has to drive to the
LR station, so i save nothing in insurance. It cost me $3 gal
for gas which I can drive approx 27miles on. With the light
rail system it would cost me approx $5 to park my car,
perhaps as much as $4 for a round trip ticket to say Rogers
(about 25 miles away=50 miles round rip) So now I have
spent $9 dollars plus my time parking, getting on and off the
rail, then when I get to Rogers I have to get a cab or rent a
car to go where I am going...

Tim : There are a gazillion reasons we need this,
not the least of which is maintaining Dickson Street as a
destination. With a Dickson Street stop we will have the
opportunity to have mountains of people from the north
stream into Fayetteville to see shows, eat at restaurants, and
spend their sweet, sweet tax dollars here in Fayetteville. They
won't even have to worry about where to park, because they
will have parked remotely. Plus, we won't have to worry
about parking or dangerous interstate driving when we go to
Crystal Bridges or the airport. It's a HUGE win-win for
everyone involved.

A post by Suzanne that was deleted read in part "I don't have the
time or energy to sit here and dig through all of the research
that has been done on this topic, and I don't have to justifymy viewpoint, as I am entitled to it"

Laurie Lee Masterson
a Gazillion is a lot I am not sure where that falls after a trillion
but since it is really hard to conceive of that figure please list
for me outside of "maintaining" Dickson which that argument
seems a little flawed, what are some specific 3-4 other
reasons that this is a "great idea"?
Suzanne, I agree you have a right to
your opinion but isn't our responsibility to INFORMED voters,
to make good responsible decisions for the "good" of all?
Voting on opinion, while your right, is not in the same vain of
thinking as you apply to the Rail system "the good/benefit to
the human being". If it is running in the hole then the wellbeing of everyone is at
stake... ppl need food, shelter and clothing before
transportation. and just a side note the Constitution (voted on by the people)
is the foundation for all law and should be followed to the
letter if in fact we are interested in Human Kind.
thank you for your time, my hope and prayer is that ppl will
be come informed educated voters and not emotional
reactionary voters.
God's Speed

S.K. RE: ppl in town commuting to rail stations. ppl in
town will have a variety of choices regarding their commute
to/from a rail station. Depending on proximity, folks might
walk on city sidewalks, walk on the trail system, ride a bike,
ride a scooter, carpool with others from their neighborhood,
have a spouse or partner drop them off and pick them up,
ride Razorback Transit. Other commuting solutions would be
part of the discussion in planning a light rail system. Folks
may opt for more economical cars if their daily commute is 5
mi rather than 50 mi. There are many possibilities for those

Laurie Lee Masterson those are all great options for a
select few, what about ppl with families that say live more
than 2 miles from the station? Then there is the problem of
parking, Downtown Fay is already a parking nightmare, where
do all the rider cars park, what the expense be of the parking
garage? Again I am not strictly opposed to the rail idea, just think
before we step out there and spend 1-2 million on a
feasibility study there are some things to consider.
1) who pays for the study?
2) where does that money come from, are we going into debt
to do this study?
3) are the other areas involved already committed to the
project? If we spend 2 mill and Springdale says no then what?
they are cutting their budget dramatically now.
4) what about land, the cost of absorbing the land needed for
this?
5) The usage variable, our population compared to the other
areas this is implement (I might add without profit) are much
larger, ten fold n some cases. Can we justify the amount of
ppl who use this


Tim Laurie--I thought I did? Access to the airport
and Crystal Bridges....remember that? If you want me to keep
going...
Less environmental impact because of traffic on 540, Access
for Wal-Mart employees who live down here to the hqrs, less
drunk driving accidents, more traffic and commerce at Drake
Field if that station is built (which helps out all the industry in
Fayetteville), access from Drake to the business districts of
Fayetteville, access for Tyson employees who live in other
cities to their hqrs, transportation for students who don't have
vehicles (unlike YOU), more money in sales taxes for those
who stop at the mall station who don't want to fight the
traffic, an incentive for people like you to drop their vehicles
all together and ride bikes like they do in other metropolitan
areas, an incentive for Wal-Mart to stay based here. I'm
gonna stop before I hit a gazillion.
Now, you may not be convinced, but you
don't have to ride it if you don't want to pay the parking fee,
or park for free somewhere and walk, or take a bike. It's a
free country. But you'll wind up paying $9 in gas to drive back
and forth between Fayetteville and Bentonville anyway, most
likely, even if the ticket prices were that high--plus you have
the option to ride.
My point here being, that it is good for you. But just because
you don't like it since it apparently won't save YOU on
insurance, doesn't mean it's not a good idea for the rest of
NWA and Fayetteville.
And FACT POLICE--the constitution was voted on by state
legislatures, not the people. Also, in reading your earlier
posts....unless we make over $250,000/yr. "we" won't be receiving a
tax increase on the federal level. Maybe YOU will, but the vast
majority of "we" voters shall not.

Laurie Lee Masterson can you please refer me to the the
study from other places where these fact bare out?
How do i ride my bike with two children, groceries, sports
gear, friends of kids. How many Walmart/tyson ppl commute that will relinquish
their cars? don't they have to drive to the station? what about
their families, and what "more sales tax"? it cost 40-60 mill for hwy but over
124 mill/mile for rail. for 100 miles is would be
12,400,000,000 we are getting closer to your gazillion
I am not looking for an argument I am looking for a
discussion on the facts, not my opinion or yours or what
either of us believes we know... what do the facts say.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Article
s/000/000/002/351jldsx.asp
I would encourage you to go and
read the bill about 250,000 being the cap for taxes. And that
is not taking into account the cap-n-trade tax, health care tax,
efca tax, new highschool tax, new dog park tax, new fuel tax,
new cash for clunkers tax, new state funded parks tax, new
state lottery tax, new state river project tax... and there really
are a gazillion of these. it makes no difference what tax
bracket you are in what matters is what are the ppl paying
the taxes in...business owners will increase their products to
you in affect you loose buying power, and when they raise it
they do it exponentially..to regain profit. there is a much
bigger picture than just having a new rail that would be nice to
us

Tim: The Weekly Standard is a right-wing rag.
Clearly you do not understand how taxes work. Let me
explain some things. First, there are not taxes for all those
things such as a "cash for clunkers tax". Much of the stuff you
mentioned is federal (I won't even mention Arkansas because
our Democratically-run state is lowering taxes, and there is
not a lottery tax, that would be counter-intuitive all together
now wouldn't it?), and most federal taxes come out of the
federal income tax you see in your paycheck. The other ones
are mostly local sales taxes (STILL at 9.25%, and hasn't
changed in a WHILE in Fayetteville) and property taxes (I got
my letter yesterday letting me know that my value is now
lower, along with everyone else, and we will have to pay LESS
NOW than in the past few years).
And as for the children and groceries thing, not my problem. I
would suggest moving closer to town if you have to move
around so much. But complaining won't solve your problems.
Oh, and you
might put them in public school (since you
pay for it anyway) where they could have bus service, thus
saving you money and saving the environment at the same
time (not that you seem to care all that much).

post here by Suzanne that was deleted- saying that she did not have to stand for my insults, she had a masters degree and was a researcher.

Laurie Lee Masterson: Timall the taxes I listed are real taxes including the lottery tax,
itis called a regressive tax. The cash for clunkers is paid by
federal tax dollars which are taxes. anything and everything
the fed. gov pays for is from tax money which is paid by tax
payers. Arkansas is not lowering taxes we are one of the
highest taxed states in the entire US and Fay is one of the
most expensive places to live. Your property tax going down
is not because taxes went down it is because property values
went down so that is actually worse for you than if they had
raised your taxes, you have less equity. So not matter what
level they are on they are all taxes that come out of our pay
and they are all going up and exponentially, all the while our
assets are going down, home values, 401k's, the dollar itself.
As for my children I am not complaining I am very aware that
I already pay for schools I don't use.
I am simply asking questions and stating facts from research
I have done on the light rail. why must you attack me
personally ..." not that you seem to care all that much" are
you assuming because I am not in favor of spending millions
of dollars on an unproven "upgrade" that I not concerned
with the environment? I find that a little brash. You don't know
me, don't know where or how my family and i live.
I am simply asking where the proof in your argument is.
Where are the studies? The data? As far as the "right wing
rag" i didn't know light rail was a left/right issue?
Suzanne-I have not once said anything that would imply I was judging
you I just simply reiterated what you said " I don't have the
time or energy to sit here and dig through all of the research
that has been done on this topic, and I don't have to justify
my viewpoint, as I am entitled to it." Implying that your
decision is not based on facts but simply the fact that you
think the light rail is a good idea, again that is your right, but
again i would submit that making a decision of the
magnitude, putting our community literally 100's of Millions of
dollars in debt we might do our due diligence before signing
off on it. there is no insult intended. And as far as a masters
degree that is something to be proud to have, I never said
you were ill-informed you told me you didn't want to be
informed